New Cover by… ME! (Satch content inside)
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Rick Graham.
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So after a while, I finally decided to do another cover. This one is of one of my favorite of Joe’s songs, and it is Cryin’
I had been meaning to do this for years but because of “things” it always seemed to get pushed off to the wayside. But now I figured enough was enough and get this down.
I took some liberties with this song and really tried to make it my own instead of it just being another mindless robotic cover of the original that so many others do. And just for the sake of saying so, this was probably the 7th or so take and my fingers were KILLING me! :p
Despite the pain, I think I did a pretty good job with this.
Enjoy!
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Hi Robert.
You certainly done it justice dude. Your tone was great and the phrasing was also spot on!
Great rendition of a great tune.
Keep up the good work man
@RobertM20 5859 wrote:
So after a while, I finally decided to do another cover. This one is of one of my favorite of Joe’s songs, and it is Cryin’
I had been meaning to do this for years but because of “things” it always seemed to get pushed off to the wayside. But now I figured enough was enough and get this down.
I took some liberties with this song and really tried to make it my own instead of it just being another mindless robotic cover of the original that so many others do. And just for the sake of saying so, this was probably the 7th or so take and my fingers were KILLING me! :p
Despite the pain, I think I did a pretty good job with this.
Enjoy!
Hey RobertM20,
How are you? I am off to a gig (chalk full of “midless and robotic renditions of Tool songs! (lol!) I hear whatr your saying about the amount of “creativity” (or the lack thereof) associated with “note-for-note” covers. However, I believe to cast all such performances as “mindless,” is a bit short-sighted and arrogant. Sure, you are entitled to your opinion, (and I actually agree with it in principal but not in your specific wording and condescending delivery!) I actually perform in three different bands, a Tool tribute, a (variety) rock-cover band, and an acoustic duo (covers also) The Tool tribute and some of the rock-cover gig are all “mindless robotics!” Some of the rock-cover gig allows me to improvise, and the acoustic duo turns into a ridiculous (and fun as hell!) “jazz-odyssey” on most nights! (Spinal Tap reference! We’re actually NOT jazzy – well most of the time! But we DO improvise A LOT!) I think there’s merit to all of it. What if there’s a student out here in IG land, who’s ONLY motivation to play is to play “note-for-note” covers? (I know, most people aspire to some amount of creativity, but you never know…) You may have dashed there dreams, or atleast may have made them feel inferior?!?
Again Robert, you are an EXCELLENT player (really!) and of course, you are entitled to your opinion, but maybe just think about the potentially fragile psyche of a potentially motivated student, before you completely dismiss ALL of there efforts and dreams? OK dude? BTW, I’ll be fine, I can improvise PLENTY (just NOT tonight!!! – lol!)
Take care man! Keep Jammin’!!!!
~Bill Meehan~
@billmeedog 5866 wrote:
Hey RobertM20,
How are you? I am off to a gig (chalk full of “midless and robotic renditions of Tool songs! (lol!) I hear whatr your saying about the amount of “creativity” (or the lack thereof) associated with “note-for-note” covers. However, I believe to cast all such performances as “mindless,” is a bit short-sighted and arrogant. Sure, you are entitled to your opinion, (and I actually agree with it in principal but not in your specific wording and condescending delivery!) I actually perform in three different bands, a Tool tribute, a (variety) rock-cover band, and an acoustic duo (covers also) The Tool tribute and some of the rock-cover gig are all “mindless robotics!” Some of the rock-cover gig allows me to improvise, and the acoustic duo turns into a ridiculous (and fun as hell!) “jazz-odyssey” on most nights! (Spinal Tap reference! We’re actually NOT jazzy – well most of the time! But we DO improvise A LOT!) I think there’s merit to all of it. What if there’s a student out here in IG land, who’s ONLY motivation to play is to play “note-for-note” covers? (I know, most people aspire to some amount of creativity, but you never know…) You may have dashed there dreams, or atleast may have made them feel inferior?!?
Again Robert, you are an EXCELLENT player (really!) and of course, you are entitled to your opinion, but maybe just think about the potentially fragile psyche of a potentially motivated student, before you completely dismiss ALL of there efforts and dreams? OK dude? BTW, I’ll be fine, I can improvise PLENTY (just NOT tonight!!! – lol!)
Take care man! Keep Jammin’!!!!
~Bill Meehan~
Ok dude, I hear what your saying but in all honesty, I think there is a bit of ‘Miscommunication’ here about what I said which you might have taken out of context.
When I said “Mindless and robotic” I wasn’t ragging on anyone’s playing at all, nor was I tooting my own horn and acting superior. When I said that, I was conferring the fact that alot of people spend so much time trying to sound EXACTLY like the person they are covering instead of really sitting down and trying to make their own niche in their playing style. Sure, I know when I do a cover of something, I make sure I get it down as perfect to the original as possible. THEN I go through and see what I can do differently that still sounds good within the context of the song and lets me put my own stamp on the composition. I don’t do this all the time, but when covering full songs I like to do this. It kinda keeps me on my toes. :p
And to what you said about someone who’s only motivation is to learn note-for-note covers and that I might have demolished their hopes… I did not mean to do that at all. If I did, than for those out there I truly apologize cause I don’t know what I am saying. 😀
If it makes them grab their guitars every day and play more power to them. I am not here to tear down anyone.I dont’ know… perhaps I should have worded Mindless and Robotic a bit differently. I forget how sensitive some people are to things. (not pointing any fingers, just in general) I know one night I was watching my old teacher and a buddy of his perform, and it came to a spot where they let people jam on stage, so of course everyone was yelling for me to go up. I jammed with them and I used his friends semi-hollow body cause it was originally a jazz gig. As I got up I said “Ya know, you should probably get that fixed” motioning to the slot where he had taken out his bridge pick-up. He asked why and I, without really thinking said “I don’t know, it looks kinda stupid like that” and man, he lost his mind! He screamed at me “I DID IT SO I COULD HAVE BETTER RESONANCE!” And Steve was off to the side laughing from his buddy’s outburst. Quite an awkward moment, let me tell you. 😮 A few days later I called steve to apologize for what I said and he said that it was cool and that his friend was sorry for yelling at me like he did. he was getting over alot of problems and had a short temper. he blew up on steve as well that night so I was not the only one who got knocked down a peg. :p
Anyways Bill, I hope your gig went well. 😎
@RobertM20 5867 wrote:
And to what you said about someone who’s only motivation is to learn note-for-note covers and that I might have demolished their hopes… I did not mean to do that at all. If I did, than for those out there I truly apologize cause I don’t know what I am saying. 😀
If it makes them grab their guitars every day and play more power to them. I am not here to tear down anyone.I dont’ know… perhaps I should have worded Mindless and Robotic a bit differently. I forget how sensitive some people are to things. (not pointing any fingers, just in general)
Anyways Bill, I hope your gig went well. 😎
Hey Robert M., 🙂
Thanks for responding! My gig went OK…Not too many fans (maybe with the poor economy, people are tightening their collective budgets! Either that, or maybe they went somewhere else to hear some improvisation! – LOL! – Just Kidding!) 😉
Ya know, I never really got the impression that you were implying any superiority over the general IG audience. You’ve never come across like that to me, and you and I have discussed a variety of topics in the past, and you are just as quick with your self-depracating remarks as you are on the fretboard!!! (lol!) So, I APOLOGIZE for even using the word arrogant. I believe that was a poor choice of words on my part! 😮 Let it be known as I said in the previous reply, that you are an EXCELLENT guitarist, and I would fully expect you to embrace a more creative approach to “cover-song interpretation.” (Although I would also respect a note-for-note rendition, if you so choosed!) Anyways, I totally agree with your statement regarding “if it makes them grab their guitar every day, then more power to them!” PERFECT! That is part of my uderlying philosophy while teaching (for the last 20 years!) That is to get the guitar in their hands, regardless of their personal motivations (IE: If that means Billy Joe Armstrong, then Green Day it is!!!) Then once they get used to the instrument being a rewarding part of their life, I try to expose them to more “substantial” musical challenges. Therefore I might recommend Hendrix before Cobain if the student is into “dead-lefties from Seattle who were 27 y.o. when they died!” (lol!) Or if I have a “metal” student, I might point them towards Dime or Petrucci before Kirk Hammett. Again, I wouldn’t criticize Cobain or Hammett (publicly) but I might say “Hey if you like that, then maybe check out this?” Do you see what I mean? I also try to break down the typical barrier of intimidation that’s associated with “beginners” improvising! I find that most beginners just don’t seem to be able to “get started!” Ya know?!? So I demonstrate improvisation (using a VERY limited vocabulary and a few expressive elements, just to show how fun & cool this can be!!! ) over some backing track loops that are built-in to my Fender G-DEC 30 amp that I teach with (GREAT teaching amp, BTW!) So, I guess I’m saying that eventually I try to get through to the students about improvisation and creativity. Funny thing I’ve discovered is that most students don’t need too much “prodding” once they get “into it!” 😉
Anyways, I digress….as usual! 😮
I really do appreciate your honesty Robert! In this “Politically Correct” world we live in, it gets more & more difficult to speak one’s mind! In the ying & yang, I think the world actually needs more people like you, to keep people on their toes! 😎
BTW, you really are an excellent guitarist, and I wish you the best in your continued pursuit of excellence! 😉
P.S. How’s the picking-overhaul going? Mine is going slowly, but steadily improving! Remember, we’re supposed to periodically “bust each others ba**s” about practicing! (lol!) :rolleyes:
~Bill Meehan~
Sorry for not replying to original topic, I kinda can´t listen to music on this computer – I just wanted to say that it can be VERY beneficial to try to replicate another musicians music, just to see the possibilities one has in playing and creating music. It can make you more open minded which I see as all-good.
M.
Robert Great playing as usual and I liked your twist to the song:cool: I think what you said was took out of context also… this is the internet and its hard to convey the right words sometimes, so as people can understand your meaning… what you meant was to add your own voice so to speak to the song ;)anyway great playing as usual my friend keep on rockin:cool:
@Sealer 5876 wrote:
Sorry for not replying to original topic, I kinda can´t listen to music on this computer – I just wanted to say that it can be VERY beneficial to try to replicate another musicians music, just to see the possibilities one has in playing and creating music. It can make you more open minded which I see as all-good.
M.
I think I should have been a little more clear as to what I meant in the original post. I didn’t mean to put down anything specifically. I never said that learning what others do is bad because I do it all the time and that’s how EVERYONE does it. I was saying something about those who never go beyond learning and copying what others do which is why I tried to put my own flavor in the song to make it stand out from the others and to also put my little stamp on it. If all you do is try to sound like someone else, your closing yourself off as a musician IMO. It leaves you no room to grow.
This sucks. Even on the internet, when I have to think before I say something… I STILL have to think before I think about saying what it is I want to say. :p Maybe I should get carpel tunnel so I can’t type anymore. hahaha
@Bill 5878 wrote:
Robert Great playing as usual and I liked your twist to the song:cool: I think what you said was took out of context also… this is the internet and its hard to convey the right words sometimes, so as people can understand your meaning… what you meant was to add your own voice so to speak to the song ;)anyway great playing as usual my friend keep on rockin:cool:
Hello Bill, 🙂
I respectfully disagree with your assessment of the situation here. This was NOT a case where I took ANYTHING “out of context.” Remember, in my exchange with Robert, I honestly agreed with the point he was trying to make! I merely took exception to potentially degrading “wording” of his position. That’s all. I have never seen the word mindless used in a positive or endearing context before, and this was no exception! I’ve done a lot of teaching over the years, and I was merely trying to show that there are plenty of “sensitive” folks out there who could be hurt by such derogatory terms. That’s all. If he had chosen to eliminate the word “mindless” and just said robotic instead, I would not have even replied, because in principal, I understood with and agreed with the point Robert made in context!
Robert and I discussed this further, and we’re cool with everything. I did go on to (deservedly) praise Robert’s guitar skills AND his honesty and candidness in general, because I believe that it IS healthy to have an honest and outspoken voice present and accounted for! I also mentioned to him that at his (advanced) level of guitar ability, I would expect him to push himself beyond note-for-note replication and see what types of alterations or developments he could make to an existing solo. 😉
I DO agree with you Bill that the internet (like in personal e-mails sometimes) often times leads to misunderstandings and/or misscommunications of sorts! I have run into that in band discussions before, especially when emotions start to run “high!” 😮 😉
I think in this type of forum here at Infinite Guitar, we can all be respectful of each other, without necessarily being nothing but “yes-men” to each other! Sometimes the contrarian point-of-view helps to see things in a different light, or from a different perspective. 😎
Have a great week Bill! 😀
~Bill Meehan!
@billmeedog 5881 wrote:
Hello Bill, 🙂
I respectfully disagree with your assessment of the situation here. This was NOT a case where I took ANYTHING “out of context.” Remember, in my exchange with Robert, I honestly agreed with the point he was trying to make! I merely took exception to potentially degrading “wording” of his position. That’s all. I have never seen the word mindless used in a positive or endearing context before, and this was no exception! I’ve done a lot of teaching over the years, and I was merely trying to show that there are plenty of “sensitive” folks out there who could be hurt by such derogatory terms. That’s all. If he had chosen to eliminate the word “mindless” and just said robotic instead, I would not have even replied, because in principal, I understood with and agreed with the point Robert made in context!
Robert and I discussed this further, and we’re cool with everything. I did go on to (deservedly) praise Robert’s guitar skills AND his honesty and candidness in general, because I believe that it IS healthy to have an honest and outspoken voice present and accounted for! I also mentioned to him that at his (advanced) level of guitar ability, I would expect him to push himself beyond note-for-note replication and see what types of alterations or developments he could make to an existing solo. 😉
I DO agree with you Bill that the internet (like in personal e-mails sometimes) often times leads to misunderstandings and/or misscommunications of sorts! I have run into that in band discussions before, especially when emotions start to run “high!” 😮 😉
I think in this type of forum here at Infinite Guitar, we can all be respectful of each other, without necessarily being nothing but “yes-men” to each other! Sometimes the contrarian point-of-view helps to see things in a different light, or from a different perspective. 😎
Have a great week Bill! 😀
~Bill Meehan!
Hello Bill,
When I said “took out of context” I was not directing that towards you.. what I meant was that if someone reads Roberts description of how he plays a song or words something he didn’t mean it in a negative way, now you may say “mindless” was the wrong word to use when describing his view but that’s his view and if someone gets offended by it then fair enough let them speak their mind in a positive and friendly manner (which in fairness you did ) I was merely stating that no one should take offence as to Roberts wording, and I know you and Robert are cool with everything 🙂 again I was directing that towards anyone that would happen to read this thread so they wouldn’t get hung up on the word “mindless” and let something small take away from the much bigger picture that is Roberts fantastic cover of this classic Satch tune which I do think we can agree on there 🙂 take care Bill have a great day 😀 btw I do have a lot of respect for what you are saying you seem like a cool guy 😎 Uh oh, don’t get my statement wrong, I only wanted to say that it´s beneficial to play other people´s music ;),
@Sealer 5884 wrote:
Uh oh, don’t get my statement wrong, I only wanted to say that it´s beneficial to play other people´s music ;),
agree 1000% 😀
@Sealer 5884 wrote:
Uh oh, don’t get my statement wrong, I only wanted to say that it´s beneficial to play other people´s music ;),
Don’t worry, I didn’t misinterpret what you said. And I agree wholeheartedly that learning other peoples music is beneficial. Like I had said, it’s how you learn as a player. 😎
Now that I think everyone has dissected and interpreted what I had originally posted and had their say (including me), it’s time to get back to why I made this thread… which is to show how awesome I am! :p:D
*Ego Explodes*
@RobertM20 5890 wrote:
Don’t worry, I didn’t misinterpret what you said. And I agree wholeheartedly that learning other peoples music is beneficial. Like I had said, it’s how you learn as a player. 😎
Now that I think everyone has dissected and interpreted what I had originally posted and had their say (including me), it’s time to get back to why I made this thread… which is to show how awesome I am! :p:D
*Ego Explodes*
Hey Robert, 🙂
Touche my friend! I know you’re kidding, because you’re not the conceited type, but I’m gonna do your bragging for you, OK? 😉
You are AWESOME! That’s a fact! BTW, after all that, great job on the Satch solo itself! 😎
Also, on an unrelated note: I just checked out your 3-string triad sweep tutorial last night, and it’s outstanding for anyone out here (like I/me!) who needs work on their sweeping in general! Kudos! 😀
~Bill Meehan~
“Maybe I should get carpel tunnel so I can’t type anymore. hahaha”
Robert, 🙂
I know that you were kidding/joking with your quote from an earlier reply, but did I ever tell you about my bout with Carpel Tunnel Syndrome? 🙁
I was very close to having surgery on it when I decided to do something WAY more rewarding and ultimately cured me of the condition: I Quit my DAYJOB! :p I went to college for computer engeineering, and that was the field I was working in full-time, until April 15, 1994, the day I left my day-job as a Diagnostics Engineer for a computer company. I’ve never looked back! Sure I don’t make as much money as I used to, but I absolutely LOVE going to work every day (mostly teaching, gigging on weekends, occasional recording projects.) As a DIagnostics Engineer I had to generate (code), debug, and test thousands of lines of machine and microprocessor level computer-language, so I was typing most of my 8 hours-per-day that I worked! Then I’d come home and practice (woodshed) and then either go teach (part-time then,) or go to a rehearsal or gig! My hands NEVER got a break! Within a few weeks of leaving my day-job, I regained all sensation and strength in my hands & fingers! (It was getting bad – tingling, numbness, loss-of-strength and control – all the tell-tale symptoms of C.T.S.!)
Moral of this story: If your hands hurt, QUIT your day-job (even if it has NOTHING to do with anything!!! – LOL!) 😀
~Bill Meehan~
@billmeedog 5892 wrote:
“Maybe I should get carpel tunnel so I can’t type anymore. hahaha”
Robert, 🙂
I know that you were kidding/joking with your quote from an earlier reply, but did I ever tell you about my bout with Carpel Tunnel Syndrome? 🙁
I was very close to having surgery on it when I decided to do something WAY more rewarding and ultimately cured me of the condition: I Quit my DAYJOB! :p I went to college for computer engeineering, and that was the field I was working in full-time, until April 15, 1994, the day I left my day-job as a Diagnostics Engineer for a computer company. I’ve never looked back! Sure I don’t make as much money as I used to, but I absolutely LOVE going to work every day (mostly teaching, gigging on weekends, occasional recording projects.) As a DIagnostics Engineer I had to generate (code), debug, and test thousands of lines of machine and microprocessor level computer-language, so I was typing most of my 8 hours-per-day that I worked! Then I’d come home and practice (woodshed) and then either go teach (part-time then,) or go to a rehearsal or gig! My hands NEVER got a break! Within a few weeks of leaving my day-job, I regained all sensation and strength in my hands & fingers! (It was getting bad – tingling, numbness, loss-of-strength and control – all the tell-tale symptoms of C.T.S.!)
Moral of this story: If your hands hurt, QUIT your day-job (even if it has NOTHING to do with anything!!! – LOL!) 😀
~Bill Meehan~
Wow Bill, I’m sorry to hear that had happened to you, but i’m glad you quit your day job in favor of something less “Stressful” (On your hands anyways. ;))
Seriously, I never would be able to do that. It would be too mundane for me to go through that every day. I’m a spoiled dude so I usually get what I want and I would put up such a fit if I had to do THAT for the rest of my life. hahahaha. That’s why I am trying to make it as a musician. It’s the only thing that gets me up in the morning.
Unfortunately for me, I do not have a day job to quit from, being that I was let go a month and a half ago from it because of the economy and have been applying left and right for jobs. What really blows was that before I was working, I had been applying as usual and not hearing anything back, but as soon as I went to work full time, I got 3 calls from potential employers saying they wanted me to come in for an interview and I had to say no thanks because I was working. Little did I know that 2 weeks later I would be let go, and never even remembered who the people were that called me! :p (You can probably imagine how hard I was kicking myself in the ass over THAT!) It was funny though because when I went to see my teacher perform at The Jazz Estate in Downtown Milwaukee one night with my buddy Andy, I told him what i was doing for a living, and he said (Dude, you job is to not make F***ing cheesehead hats. YOUR job is to get out there and play!) I had tried to get a job teaching at one of the many music stores here but apparently, according to them, they were all full. So I told Steve and he said “Dude, try wearing a suit and tie when you go in there. They’ll give you the job if your wearing that. You can do ANYTHING if you’ve got a tie on. You could steal someone’s tires and they wouldn’t care of you had a tie on!”
Oh damn, now looks who’s deviating from the topic. 😀
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